Talk:Bluebeard

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to navigation Jump to search

Untitled[edit]

" a cautionary tale against the dangers of curiosity and feminine disobedience" I'm surprised some self-important interfering coxcomb hasn't challenged this innocuously interpretive statement as "POV". Look at the "rewrites" at Rapunzel! --Wetman 05:30, 14 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Gilles de Rais and the Marquis de Laval[edit]

I believe that Gilles de Rais and the Marquis de Laval were actually the same person. They're both from the same place and the same time, and the father of Gilles de Rais had "Laval" as part of his title. I could, however, be completely wrong — feel free to revert me if this is the case. -- Vardion 06:39, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Distracting blank spaces[edit]

Formatting that encases the framed table of contents in text, in just the way a framed map or image is enclosed within the text, is now available: {{TOCleft}} in the HTML does the job.

Blank space opposite the ToC, besides being unsightly and distracting, suggests that there is a major break in the continuity of the text, which may not be the case. Blanks in page layout are voids and they have meanings to the experienced reader. The space betweeen paragraphs marks a brief pause between separate blocks of thought. A deeper space, in a well-printed text, signifies a more complete shift in thought: note the spaces that separate sub-headings in Wikipedia articles.

A handful of thoughtless and aggressive Wikipedians revert the "TOCleft" format at will. A particularly aggressive de-formatter is User:Ed g2s

The reader may want to compare versions at the Page history. --Wetman 19:54, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Too trivial?[edit]

Bluebeard is an important character in the Fables comic book series. He is portrayed as ostensibly reformed, having had to leave his homeland for our world to escape a conqueror; however, he is still much like his old self beneath his urbane appearance, and uses his wealth to manipulate his fellow "Fables." Is this too trivial, or does it enrich and deepen everyone's undersytanding of Bluebeard? Isn't every familiar name of any figure of culture or mythology used as a comicbook something-or-other? Does Spider-Man provide a suitable paragraph at Arachnid? --Wetman 23:44, 25 September 2005 (UTC)
There does seem to be a strange interest in sticking in the Fables comic book series everywhere. I don't think it adds.Goldfritha 00:45, 6 June 2006 (UTC)
I think it makes sense to include a mention of this representation of the character; as he is apparently a key figure in the series, the Fables depiction counts as a modern interpretation of the Bluebeard legend. How is the representation in the Fables comic book series any less relevant than those included in the ballets or operas? You could just as easily say "every familiar name of any figure of culture or mythology" has been used in literature or painting or dance or music, etc. I think it's less the relevance of the particular representation that troubles you, and more the medium itself. --Awakeandalive1, 6 June 2006
Knowing a little about Richard Wagner's Ring Cycle makes What's Opera, Doc? (1957) more enjoyable. The relevance doesn't operate the other way. The Bluebeard story makes the Fable depiction comprehensible. The relevance doesn't operate the other way. Everyone understands this. --Wetman 06:36, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Neil Gaiman[edit]

Is the story mentioned actually based on Bluebeard? It sounds much more like The Robber Bridegroom to me. Goldfritha 00:45, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Found a version of "Mr Fox" and relocated the story to Robber Bridegroom, where it fits better. (Provided a link to the story there.) Goldfritha 00:32, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

Shakespeare[edit]

Can someone add a little more context to the Shakespeare quote? It's not clear to me how it's referring to a Bluebeard-like story. 70.91.217.210 17:56, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Humm.
Actually, if you go to The Robber Bridegroom (fairy tale) , and look at the link to the "Mr Fox" story, you will find that exact quote. So I would say that it is an allusion to that fairy tale -- and should be moved. Goldfritha 23:04, 21 July 2006 (UTC)
Moved! Goldfritha 19:16, 13 August 2006 (UTC)

Perrault[edit]

Did Perrault come up with the story, or just write down an oral tradition? If so, I don't think the article should say he "wrote" it. Tim Long 23:32, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

Former text in this article was clearer on Perrault's sources, I seem to remember. It's been eliminated. Do you have issues with Shakespeare too, then? With him using Hollinshead's Chronicle, Ovid, etc? Why would you not think Perrault wrote it, if you're reading it? Perhaps you've never actually seen the text of "Bluebeard" and doubt that it exists. --Wetman 01:53, 1 September 2006 (UTC)
The sensible former version of this article, with information that has been deleted, can be inspected here. --Wetman 02:00, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Blue?[edit]

Anyone ever give a reason why his beard was "blue", either though cause or by inference (EG. Did the blue stand for something, like evil) ? 68.39.174.238 20:23, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I always read it as being so deep a black a that it appears blue, like its shining. It's commonly shown as being such a dark colour because he's a "sinister Oriental" character, with stereotypical thick, dark beard. Secrets Beyond the Door (or something like that), is a good book on the subject of this tale. -- Jayunderscorezero 21:58, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Adaptations[edit]

What happened to the rest of this section? Didn't there used to be more subsections than simply 'literature'? -- Jayunderscorezero 21:58, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I dont see it in the history. The entries should at least be in chronological order, though. Sparafucil 12:05, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

References in Popular Culture[edit]

Does this article need one of these as well? Some of the things listed under "adaptations" are more properly references in popular culture, and there are references in popular culture to the character of Bluebeard which are not properly considered adaptations, (cf. The Wendy Trilogy, but I know there are others.). --Parcequilfaut (talk) 05:34, 7 September 2008 (UTC)

It occurred to me that the 2001, 2010 etc. novels by Arthur C. Clarke have a reference to the Bluebeard folklore: "All these worlds are yours, except Europa; attempt no landings there." 173.174.85.204 (talk) 00:43, 10 May 2017 (UTC) Eric

Henry VIII[edit]

Has Henry VIII ever been mentioned as a possible fit for Bluebeard ? He did have an odd temper and did execute two of his six wives. Another possible fit would be Old King Cole, since King Henry was in some ways a merry old soul. [1] ADM (talk) 21:37, 20 April 2009 (UTC)

A very common, but also a very erroneous opinion, is that the legend of Bluebear was devised by Roman Catholics as a satire on Henry VIII. See: John Timbs, Things not generally known: popular errors explained & illustrated. pg. 227, London (1858). Krenakarore (talk) 10:23, 20 October 2009 (UTC)

Brothers Grimm[edit]

Somebody added the Brothers Grimm template to this article. I don't see the connection; the article says nothing about a Grimm adaptation of this story, and I can't find it in any list of Grimm fables. I removed it; if there's something I'm missing, please re-add, but also add some text to the article about the Grimm connection.—Chowbok 04:13, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

Conomor a werewolf?[edit]

this article mentions that Conomor was known locally as a werewolf, however there is no mention of that in Conomor's article, and doesn't seem to be in the French versions of these articles either. I find it very interesting, but it would be great to see any sources or other mentions elsewhere on the internet. -- Linus Wesley — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.84.32.124 (talk) 20:36, 18 July 2011 (UTC)

Wording[edit]

"Gilles de Rais, a 15th-century aristocrat and prolific serial killer, has been suggested as the source for the character of Bluebeard as being Conomor the Accursed, an early Breton king"

Is it just me, or does this read incorrectly? Should 'being' not be 'has'? Grunners (talk) 14:09, 15 September 2012 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 4 external links on Bluebeard. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true or failed to let others know (documentation at {{Sourcecheck}}).

As of February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{sourcecheck}} (last update: 15 July 2018).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 15:41, 4 November 2016 (UTC)

Korean Modern Interpretation?[edit]

Under "Variations," a "thoroughly modernized" Korean version of the fairy tale has recently been added, with a very long block of text outlining the plot. This seems out of place, as the summary of the Korean version is longer than the summary of the original Bluebeard tale. Additionally, it has no citations (though I don't know whether this is expected for a list-type section in an article) and no author listed. A cited (?) mention of the story a couple of sentences seems appropriate, but as it is, it's distractingly long and unsourced. I'm relatively new here and I don't want to trim so much text without mention, but the article doesn't benefit from it right now. - Liv Handsome (talk) 20:28, 31 December 2017 (UTC)

Looks like it's been fixed. - Liv Handsome (talk) 21:10, 1 January 2018 (UTC)

Trivial References to Popular Culture[edit]

This tag was recently added:

This article appears to contain trivial, minor, or unrelated references to popular culture. Please reorganize this content to explain the subject's impact on popular culture rather than simply listing appearances; add references to reliable sources if possible. Unsourced material may be challenged and removed. (June 2018)

These are not "trivial references to popular culture." They are serious literary works inspired by the fairy tale. A real encyclopedia would include them. And a filmography or bibliography format is perfectly valid. For scholars of the fairy tale, these lists provide invaluable research material. All of the fairy tale pages on Wikipedia include these types of lists.Carnival Honey (talk) 18:42, 6 July 2018 (UTC)

I am going to remove this tag, if no one objects. It does not accurately reflect the references in the article, which are professionally arranged and sourced. Carnival Honey (talk) 02:59, 9 July 2018 (UTC)